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  • #46
    Originally posted by Tim (ZosoRocks)

    I am not in the YNP camp. In fact...never was. Sorry.

    so..i will not really discuss a solution that has already been shown to have many inconsistencies, errors, inaccuracies...especually to explain why I don't accept that false narrative.

    Maybe you should put forth your JUSTIFIABLE and VERIFIABLE evidence that shows it to be accurate. I have plenty of doubt it is...which based upon statistics...doubt means error...which leads to failure. Thus, it is wrong.

    If you believe YNP - then post your objectiveness for others to rip apart...lol ...because I sure will make an attempt.

    I believe that is how we get to the ending...dismiss all presented solutions...until only one stands solid.
    I've posted pretty much all of it already, though admittedly piecemeal and while I was still refining parts. I've already tried disproving it without success but everything connects together too perfectly. I have no personal preference for YNP and 9MH, in fact I was a vocal early opponent. But then I bore down and really tried to understand. It's hard, but it.can be done. You do need to recognize Forrest's design, what he was trying to do. Once you do, you can see so many things that are clever, imaginative and logical. Hard to describe but it's a feeling of seeing something that Forrest said or wrote and immediately recognizing the hidden meaning at a deep level. And that is possible I believe because Forrest followed a set of rules, kept to the same pattern (except a few slip-ups), and used a consistent method to create and manage the chase. I wish more people were willing to listen good, because in many ways it is a remarkable, almost magical, thing that Forrest did. If you or anybody really wants to discover it for themselves, I'm all for helping though this forum is probably not the best way.

    Comment


    • #47
      Originally posted by willynilly

      In the early days Fenn likely assumed the finder would not be able to keep it quiet and turn it in to the park. That’s certainly a way to know it was found weather Fenn was alive or not.

      Yellowstone was special to Forrest, nobody can deny that.
      There were issues with putting it there but he was going to make it work no matter what because he was a sentimental man. Once found he assumed searches would think it was obvious that he put it there, but I guess not.
      Yes absolutely. But I don't think he was going to make it work no matter what out of sentimentality but rather the sheer chutzpah of not only successfully hiding the TC without detection but in designing a treasure hunt that is actually incredibly simple (technically a child can solve it) but at the same time incredibly difficult (because of our biases, assumptions and ossified patterns of thought). Forrest was an expert in human behavior and he put that to great use in creating the chase.

      The design of the chase was not to hide things but instead to put them out there in the open in a way that searchers would find very challenging to comprehend. That includes the TC as the spot is (barely) visible from the road (thus "tarry scant with marvel gaze"). And I suspect Forrest didn't expect that to change after the announcement of the find.

      He did give plenty of hints about his design including in the poem itself. For example, "I can keep my secret where" refers not to a hiding spot that is a personal secret that nobody else knows about but rather a spot that is secret because he went there alone. In other words, it's not a "secret where [that only he knows about]" but rather it is a "secret where [he went alone]". This interpretation is fully supported by how he discusses "secret" and "alone" in Flywater. I doubt more than 9 searchers have made this connection (probably less). I did so only recently, and I doubt I'm finished discovering little gems like this.
      Last edited by Blazingwaddles; 09-24-2022, 09:31 PM.

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      • #48
        Originally posted by Fenndery View Post

        Or just double down on juvenile name calling AGAIN . It's ok , I am not the only one reading the flags . Lets see how this works out for you . I can't even call you a troll , you will probably pin a badge on your forehead telling everyone how proud you are .

        My sincere apologies for derailing . I will flag and cease from further futile conversation with bw.
        Your loss, that is 100% assured.

        Comment


        • #49
          Originally posted by willynilly

          lol Re hiding it for the sheer chutzpah, he sure was tenacious, prolly why I liked him so. Don’t forget Jack also mentioned that sentimentality, it played a huge roll. So yeah, a little of column a and b there.
          Yes absolutely, I just meant the "making it work no matter what" refers to the location being on the busiest road in the busiest National Park. That was probably the most complicated and trickiest location he could have picked to hide a heavy box filled with gold! But that's also why it worked so well ... it's hard to believe that is the spot. Some people will apparently never be convinced.

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          • #50
            Originally posted by Blazingwaddles View Post

            Your loss, that is 100% assured.
            lol

            Click image for larger version  Name:	cheerful-OP-is-a-Faggot-memes.jpg Views:	0 Size:	67.5 KB ID:	456516

            "Make it Happen! With the Power of Thought" - Mrs. and Mr. Fenndery (close to each and every day)

            Comment


            • #51
              Originally posted by willynilly

              I hear you, it might all be lies and it might not. All I’m seeing here are accusations with a lack of evidence. I ask you, why lie?
              Why lie and say it was in Yellowstone if it really wasn’t?Would it being found in Yellowstone benefit any person or entity in some way?

              Just like many things, there are loop holes in law.
              One option would have been to turn it in if it was abandoned, however, it wasn’t abandoned. Forrest left it there and publicly challenged the real owners of the park, the people, to find it. Someone found it and returned it to its rightful owner with his consent. This would also be acceptable by law, especially if communicated via a competent lawyer. Perhaps this is in writing somewhere, perhaps it took a month of waiting for the dust to settle and red tape in order to get this document to Sarah Davis. This is all speculation and imo of course. I know nothing and have no evidence
              If what you are saying about the property needing to be abandoned, then everybody could just leave their campers and tents wherever they wanted as long as they did not say it was abandoned. Sorry, but that is not the way it works. If you leave something unattended for 24 hours it is automatically considered abandonded or unattended and both are illegal and both must be turned over to the park superintendent when found. No where does it say you can have a zoom call a few months later because you want to manufacture a false story. It has been over two years and they still have not turned the chest into the park superintendent as required. That simple fact most likely means it was never there and the zoom call was all about setting up a false story, possibly even with the active participation by the ranger, knowing it was never really there. What if the call was really about just informing the park that there was no chest in the park, but to provide a warning to them that the community might be led to assume it was at some point in the future.


              § 2.22 Property.

              (a) The following are prohibited:

              (1) Abandoning property.

              (2) Leaving property unattended for longer than 24 hours, except in locations where longer time periods have been designated or in accordance with conditions established by the superintendent.

              (3) Failing to turn in found property to the superintendent as soon as practicable.
              https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/36/2.22
              Last edited by pws111; 09-25-2022, 09:02 AM.

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              • #52
                Tim (ZosoRocks) Ok that reasoning about a NP/NF makes more sense. You are being logical and sure a NF is more aligned with Forrest's ethos generically. But, he didn't fall in love with NF. He didn't spend "quality time" with his father when he was young in a NF. His avowed favorite places are not in a NF. If we let him take us there, he doesn't take us to a NF. You have to fight all the evidence, all the things FF has said and written, to end up searching for his treasure in a NF. No, he wanted to tell you to get back in the box (which NF is that shape?) where your thoughts are comfortable and flow more easily. He was like that, a guy who genuinely liked people and tried to help them find his treasure whenever the opporrunity presented itself.

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                • #53
                  Originally posted by Blazingwaddles View Post
                  You have to fight all the evidence, all the things FF has said and written, to end up searching for his treasure in a NF.

                  The evidence speaks for itself, and it doesn't point to a 'developed' national park (stores, gas stations, boardwalks, etc.

                  "Fenn's infamous treasure hunt began 10 years ago, when the author published a cryptic poem in his autobiography meant to lead prospective explorers to the spot in the Wyoming wilderness where his treasure chest was hidden."

                  "Fenn says he filled a chest with gold, jewels and other valuables worth an estimated $2 million and hid it a decade ago somewhere in the Rocky Mountain wilderness."

                  "The identity of the man who solved the riddle behind late Sante Fe millionaire Forrest Fenn's buried treasure chest and later located the long-hidden fortune in the Wyoming wilderness in June has finally been revealed."

                  "I cannot express to you the joy that my grandfather had in seeing his treasure hunt positively touch the lives of so many, and the excitement in his eyes when he saw that chest again for the first time since hiding it in the wilds of Wyoming."

                  "Getting to the wilderness location where the chest was is not dangerous in the conventional sense of the word, but it very quickly can be when people do not take basic precautions or go out in the wrong conditions."

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Originally posted by willynilly
                    Not4but242Walk

                    Is Yellowstone not mostly wilderness?
                    Absolutely not. The park is tended to (maintained by) park staff. A wilderness is left completely 'alone'. Even when something falls out of the sky, it remains a permanent part of it.

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                    • #55
                      Not4but242Walk You don't present evidence but rather a media narrative. One fostered by Forrest himself to hang dismissive searchers with their own rope constructed from assumptions. Wilderness does not have political boundaries is I think what somebody said when trying to steer the lost away from the ledge.

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                      • #56
                        Originally posted by Blazingwaddles View Post
                        Not4but242Walk You don't present evidence but rather a media narrative. One fostered by Forrest himself to hang dismissive searchers with their own rope constructed from assumptions. Wilderness does not have political boundaries is I think what somebody said when trying to steer the lost away from the ledge.
                        In the US we've codified 'wilderness' areas; the term wilderness is defined as "an area where the earth and community of life are untrammeled by man, where man himself is a visitor who does not remain" and "an area of undeveloped Federal land retaining its primeval character and influence, without permanent improvements or human habitation, which is protected and managed so as to preserve its natural conditions".
                        Lost Time is never found again. - Benjamin Franklin​

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                        • #57
                          Originally posted by RahRah View Post

                          In the US we've codified 'wilderness' areas; the term wilderness is defined as "an area where the earth and community of life are untrammeled by man, where man himself is a visitor who does not remain" and "an area of undeveloped Federal land retaining its primeval character and influence, without permanent improvements or human habitation, which is protected and managed so as to preserve its natural conditions".
                          https://www.nps.gov/yell/learn/nature/wilderness.htm

                          Read it and weep. Note the map is not drawn precisely but it is still obvious that the far bank of the Madison along 191 is part of the Recommended Wilderness that the Dept. of Interior had requested Congress to designate as protected, all the way back in 1972. After reading the linked material, please return amd share any additional or revised thoughts.

                          Not4but242Walk you too.
                          Last edited by Blazingwaddles; 09-25-2022, 02:38 PM.

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                          • #58
                            Originally posted by Blazingwaddles View Post

                            https://www.nps.gov/yell/learn/nature/wilderness.htm

                            Read it and weep. Note the map is not drawn precisely but it is still obvious that the far bank of the Madison along 191 is part of the Recommended Wilderness that the Dept. of Interior had requested Congress to designate as protected, all the way back in 1972. After reading the linked material, please return amd share any additional or revised thoughts.

                            Not4but242Walk you too.
                            Why would I read it and weep? I gave our codified definition of a wilderness area, I didn't specify or deny any particular area as being one or not.
                            Lost Time is never found again. - Benjamin Franklin​

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              Originally posted by willynilly View Post
                              I hear you, it might all be lies and it might not. All I’m seeing here are accusations with a lack of evidence. I ask you, why lie?
                              Why lie and say it was in Yellowstone if it really wasn’t?Would it being found in Yellowstone benefit any person or entity in some way?

                              Quite the opposite : I am only going by what she wrote . And it was not a lie .
                              Just for the record I concur that she did NOT lie whatsoever . She told the truth AS WRITTEN . That is all we have to go by . You can't prove a negative with a negative . You have to go by the words SHE wrote . You can't infer something that was not there . So no accusations without evidence at all .

                              And you seem to me, intelligent enough to understand that statement is a straw man , moving the goalpost to misdirect sentence .
                              "Make it Happen! With the Power of Thought" - Mrs. and Mr. Fenndery (close to each and every day)

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Sigh. You're missing one key point. Park rangers do not have authority over National Forest lands. The Forest Service manages those; it's a different set of rules and rangers. We know, we've dealt with them in those adjacent forests. If the chest was outside the park, there would be No Reason to involve YNP staff at all. If anyone had to be contacted, it would be the USFS office responsible for the location.

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