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9 Mile - The Clues

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Macahol View Post
    If the Madison is the "it" you are taking in the canyon down, why do you have to "put in"? Aren't you already in the Madison if you are taking it down? If you are driving, wouldn't you be taking the road, not the river?
    I think that's a fair question that I have also asked. I don't think Forrest was that technically perfect. If I said "take the Madison in the canyon down, not far but too far to walk", I think its fairly clear you are supposed to ride there on the road next to the river. But this is further clarified by the "put in below the HOB" - meaning that's where you actually get in the river. Just my thoughts.

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    • #17
      I would also add that this is supposed to be poetic - its poetry. Why is it that I must go? I've done it tired.... these are poetic references to the Madison river.

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      • #18
        Originally posted by Must Listengood View Post

        I think that's a fair question that I have also asked. I don't think Forrest was that technically perfect. If I said "take the Madison in the canyon down, not far but too far to walk", I think its fairly clear you are supposed to ride there on the road next to the river. But this is further clarified by the "put in below the HOB" - meaning that's where you actually get in the river. Just my thoughts.
        OK, but then if npftm = cross the river, why does that constitute "no place for the meek"? If FF was such a good wordsmith, an "architect," and put so much time into it, why such a prosaic description? For example, one could read Longfellow's Song of Thor and conclude that heading due north is "no place for the meek." That may not actually be the correct answer, but I have to believe, based on Fenn's expertise, that this would be an example of he might have structured the clues. I just have a hard time believing the poem isn't more complex than what is being suggested so far in the 9MH solves I'm seeing.

        Also, meek is a type of fishing reel. Based on that, one could conclude that npftm directs you away from the river. Being a fisherman, I think Fenn would have thought of that and avoided such a potential contradiction. Just My Two Sense.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Macahol View Post

          OK, but then if npftm = cross the river, why does that constitute "no place for the meek"? If FF was such a good wordsmith, an "architect," and put so much time into it, why such a prosaic description? For example, one could read Longfellow's Song of Thor and conclude that heading due north is "no place for the meek." That may not actually be the correct answer, but I have to believe, based on Fenn's expertise, that this would be an example of he might have structured the clues. I just have a hard time believing the poem isn't more complex than what is being suggested so far in the 9MH solves I'm seeing.

          Also, meek is a type of fishing reel. Based on that, one could conclude that npftm directs you away from the river. Being a fisherman, I think Fenn would have thought of that and avoided such a potential contradiction. Just My Two Sense.
          I sympathize with the idea that its hard to believe the poem isn't more complex. That was my biggest stumbling block. However, he did repeatedly tell us that the poem was straight forward and to simplify. He said to get back in the box. He told us this a lot. I just didn't want to listen.

          The part that I find "disturbing" are his statements about him not being surprised if the treasure wasn't found in hundreds or a thousand years. I don't like his "architect" statements in retrospect. I don't understand the 15 years (or 22 years) that he worked on the poem. But they are a matter of perspective - his vs. mine. It was hard to accept the simplicity, but once you give into it a bit, you start to realize that it was really all about his love for the Madison river that he developed as a young impressionable boy/man. That's when most of us develop these precious memories.

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          • #20
            I would reiterate to the proponents of any solution involving 9MH: Diggin Gypsy crossed to the south side of the Madison at 9MH in the summer of 2012 -- a time when no searcher communicating with Forrest had solved more than 2 clues, including her. If the act of crossing the Madison there is an execution of "From there it's no place for the meek," how had she not solved beyond 2 clues?

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Zapster View Post
              I would reiterate to the proponents of any solution involving 9MH: Diggin Gypsy crossed to the south side of the Madison at 9MH in the summer of 2012 -- a time when no searcher communicating with Forrest had solved more than 2 clues, including her. If the act of crossing the Madison there is an execution of "From there it's no place for the meek," how had she not solved beyond 2 clues?
              Good question. I don't think we will know the answer, but I'll speculate. She was probably a 200 footer, and probably someone that Forrest described as "didn't know why they were there". I think Forrest suspected that she only knew the first two clues. She didn't know the right spot to put in. She didn't know how far "not far" was. She hadn't put together the creek as the HOB. She was there, but she didn't know the clues past the first two.

              Her case makes me think the final treasure location was close to 2oo feet west of the creek (or east), rather than on the little island. But that could be wrong - Forrest may not have known her exact locations other than her pictures, one of which may have placed them 200 feet away. All of this is just my speculation of course.

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              • #22
                Must Listengood, that's a decent post. I've read alot of crazy solves. I don't know if there's an easy way to write out the answers to 9 clues without coming off like a lunatic, but you did a good job on this one.

                If the chest was easy to find it would have been found by a searcher early. While the poem was straightforward, there was some things to he solved. What was "It" beside a great vehicle in South Park, Where is wwwh ? HoB

                I'm not sold on 9MH but i'd put it around 40% probable as the location which is more than I can say for solves being pushed by conspiracy pushers. At this stage in the Chase, it takes faith to believe a solution but I don't have anything more convincing to believe in than 9MH.

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                • #23
                  A related problem is that the searcher (male, so not DG) got to within 200 feet of the treasure at a time when only 2 clues had been solved. Is the explanation that he crossed the Madison at 9MH and then headed east to within 200' of Indulgence, but did NOT explain to Forrest why he crossed the Madison there, nor why he went east, therefore he didn't solve the associated clue(s)? If that's how 9-milers handwave that away, then okay, but it's pretty flimsy reasoning.

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                  • #24
                    Another thing, Fenn said you could find the treasure if you followed the clues precisely. If HoB is really a spot in the river where brown trout congregate (gag), then "below the HoB" could be anywhere down the river after that point. That's not very precise, IMHO. To me that suggests elevation is involved. Now he didn't say under the HoB, so the put in doesn't have to be directly underneath it, but HoB ought to be something that can be identified next to the river and is above the elevation of the water. Again, just My Two Sense.

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by Zapster View Post
                      A related problem is that the searcher (male, so not DG) got to within 200 feet of the treasure at a time when only 2 clues had been solved. Is the explanation that he crossed the Madison at 9MH and then headed east to within 200' of Indulgence, but did NOT explain to Forrest why he crossed the Madison there, nor why he went east, therefore he didn't solve the associated clue(s)? If that's how 9-milers handwave that away, then okay, but it's pretty flimsy reasoning.
                      Again, I agree with asking the question, because I know I have. But think about it - even now many do not seem to grasp the subtle step by step procedure that Forrest intended. They get to the 9MH area in all kinds of crazy ways, like the mountain looks like a house, or there is a buffalo shape to the area, or etc. etc. For those that really got to within 200 feet, they were probably drawn by the creek and the lines "no paddle up your creek", but they didn't know the clues in order - which is another thing Forrest said. They didn't really know why they were there, so I suppose the point is that they didn't really develop the confidence in the solution necessary to keep looking for the blaze, with Jack being the exception. They didn't really understand the step by step procedure and have confidence in it. They only really knew two clues (Forrest said some may have known three or four later, he wasn't sure). I think Forrest got a bit of a kick out of saying "no one has more than two clues". He liked that.

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Macahol View Post
                        Another thing, Fenn said you could find the treasure if you followed the clues precisely. If HoB is really a spot in the river where brown trout congregate (gag), then "below the HoB" could be anywhere down the river after that point. That's not very precise, IMHO. To me that suggests elevation is involved. Now he didn't say under the HoB, so the put in doesn't have to be directly underneath it, but HoB ought to be something that can be identified next to the river and is above the elevation of the water. Again, just My Two Sense.
                        Yeah, per my previous post on the solve, I do not believe that HOB is a spot in the river. That's an important point I think in getting it right and getting what Forrest intended. HOB does NOT equal 9MH. Rather it is the creek where the trout spawn, one of the few or only places on the Madison river. That point seems to allude many, but I think it's right.

                        I also think Forrest's definition of precise is a lot different than mine. The "precise" thing is another disappointment to me, but again, its a matter of perspective. Putting in below the HOB just means cross the river downstream from the creek - the exact crossing point is not important - there is a section of shallow water there. But if you follow the instructions, you are going to end up at the creek no matter what.
                        Last edited by Must Listengood; 11-18-2021, 11:33 PM.

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Not4but242Walk View Post
                          Quite simply, 9MH does not show up on any typical map and is a nonsense solve.
                          look how wrong you are
                          https://mapcarta.com/29604972

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by Must Listengood View Post

                            Again, I agree with asking the question, because I know I have. But think about it - even now many do not seem to grasp the subtle step by step procedure that Forrest intended. They get to the 9MH area in all kinds of crazy ways, like the mountain looks like a house, or there is a buffalo shape to the area, or etc. etc. For those that really got to within 200 feet, they were probably drawn by the creek and the lines "no paddle up your creek", but they didn't know the clues in order - which is another thing Forrest said. They didn't really know why they were there, so I suppose the point is that they didn't really develop the confidence in the solution necessary to keep looking for the blaze, with Jack being the exception. They didn't really understand the step by step procedure and have confidence in it. They only really knew two clues (Forrest said some may have known three or four later, he wasn't sure). I think Forrest got a bit of a kick out of saying "no one has more than two clues". He liked that.
                            Are you kidding me with can't grasp the step-by-step procedure? This is something someone comes up with in the first week in the chase.
                            There is nothing to grasp other than a false solution, being pushed by people that give Forrest no credit.
                            By saying the nine-mile solution is correct, you are also saying Forrest cheated and lied.
                            You are saying he told Dal that he was within 300 feet, yet f said do not look for any clues in this email.
                            That by giving Dal the fishing logs, he was also trying to help him.
                            You are taking things f said about people being at wwwh and applying them to the put in.
                            Forrest did not intend anything to do with the nine-mile solution.
                            If I did not know for a fact it was not in the park, I would just watch the folly.
                            But trying to force this solution, you are dishonoring Mr Fenn, that much I can grasp.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by Cary_Galloway View Post

                              look how wrong you are
                              https://mapcarta.com/29604972
                              Anyone can tag anything online. Find me a AAA, National Geographic, Rand McNally or NPS map, etc. that shows it.

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                              • #30
                                https://www.thedailybeast.com/clues-...reasure-part-2
                                No matter where they were, the Fenns were fishing, and their favorite locales—disclosed in the unpublished family history—have promise as well. The Madison River’s best spots to cast a line: “the Slow Bend (five miles up), the Nine Mile Hole (you guessed it, nine miles), and the Water Hole (about eleven miles).” The parentheses are all Fenn, as are the ALL CAPS, when he writes that these spots were “TOP SECRET,” especially Nine Mile Hole, because it could hold only one fisherman. Perhaps that’s a match to the opening line of Fenn’s treasure poem, “As I have gone alone in there.”

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