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Things I dont like about 9 mile...

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  • Things I dont like about 9 mile...

    If we agree that Jack said he searched here via Condor posts, then why arent we taking him at his word when he said:
    A) Forrest prob walked a few miles.
    B) There was a fake blaze 1000 ft from the treasure that threw him off.
    500 ft x 4 is 2000 ft , less than a half mile total!
    If Jack was so sure about the football sized 'island' being the spot, how could a fake blaze 1000 ft away (over three football fields) in any direction, throw him off?
    Also, 99% of good maps or google earth will not tell you what HOB is. I do not think its fathomable to call a 15 ft wide trout hang out, the HOB without specialized knowledge.
    In that line of thought, why cant the stream near Water Hole be the spot. Hell that stream even goes deeper into an actual 'draw' than 9 mile, and without all of those 4 foot high felled logs that an 80 year old man carrying 22 lbs of gold would struggle with.
    Also, Forrest wanted to die " at that special place"
    I am pretty sure that isnt in a thicket of Forrest obscurred off the Madison without a view of " animals" to die peacefully at. Not Forrest. No, he would do it better than that. He didnt take 15 years to hide something under a random log in a thick section with no view.

  • #2
    I think it fits like a boot. I’d say glove but then that makes me think of OJ so I’ll stick with boot.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by CurseWordsAndTreasure View Post
      I think it fits like a boot. I’d say glove but then that makes me think of OJ so I’ll stick with boot.
      it fits about as well as those waders fit Kpro.
      Maybe not the perfect fit but it is totally functional as the solve.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by MicDobbs View Post
        If we agree that Jack said he searched here via Condor posts, then why arent we taking him at his word when he said:
        A) Forrest prob walked a few miles.
        B) There was a fake blaze 1000 ft from the treasure that threw him off.
        500 ft x 4 is 2000 ft , less than a half mile total!
        If Jack was so sure about the football sized 'island' being the spot, how could a fake blaze 1000 ft away (over three football fields) in any direction, throw him off?
        Also, 99% of good maps or google earth will not tell you what HOB is. I do not think its fathomable to call a 15 ft wide trout hang out, the HOB without specialized knowledge.
        In that line of thought, why cant the stream near Water Hole be the spot. Hell that stream even goes deeper into an actual 'draw' than 9 mile, and without all of those 4 foot high felled logs that an 80 year old man carrying 22 lbs of gold would struggle with.
        Also, Forrest wanted to die " at that special place"
        I am pretty sure that isnt in a thicket of Forrest obscurred off the Madison without a view of " animals" to die peacefully at. Not Forrest. No, he would do it better than that. He didnt take 15 years to hide something under a random log in a thick section with no view.
        OK, these are reasonable observations. I'll take a shot at them:

        A) Can you provide the exact quote/context of condor's post about "a few miles". I haven't seen that. Also when he said it may be important. 2018? Jack (or condor) was doing some speculating - he didn't have everything nailed down 100% - or at least he wasn't sure beyond a reasonable doubt until later, probably 2019.

        B) The fake blaze was likely across the Madison at lower 9 mile hole. He hadn't finalized the location due to not knowing whether "home" meant the creek (spawning grounds of Brown trout) or whether home meant the "residence" of brown trout (9 mile hole itself). If it meant residence, then both lower and upper 9 mile hole was in play and his search area was much bigger. Jack talked about this. He was trying to narrow down the area, but for a while, the entire 9 mile hole area (both upper and lower) was in play. The fake blaze could easily be 1000 feet from the creek area during this period of his search. I believe that HOB is NOT 9 mile hole - it is the creek, the spawning ground of brown trout.

        Jack later decided to go with the creek as the spawning grounds and narrowed his search to the creek area. He may have focused his football field on the island, or perhaps an area that was about 200 feet back and 200 feet over from the creek based on other statements from Forrest.

        The creek at Water Hole is a viable solve for investigation, but everything doesn't fit quite as well in my opinion. It's within walking distance of Madison junction, you could argue. We don't have as much evidence for it being Forrest's favorite place, and it doesn't seem as "secret". It's not Schweibert's "striking place of secrets". Remember the creek at 9 mile, with the little pond, was a kind of secret paradise to a fly fisherman before the fires. "Hint of riches new and old". Of course the biggest negative for Water Hole is that's not where Condor was searching.

        I can't agree with you about Forrest's place to die - he told us he wanted to die in a forest under a pine tree. He talked about how he would like to go a little distance away from a trail or landmark that was quite unremarkable and think to himself "no one has ever been here before". That is what made it special. That is what made it his place to die. Not a view, but a peaceful place that was his alone. I don't know if a spot on that island qualifies, or a place that is 200 feet from the creek under a tree. It was somewhere that he visited as a child/ young man and thought - this beautiful place is special and no one has ever been to this exact spot. The creek before the fires with the little pond must have been stunning and secret, especially during spawning season. That would have made quite an impression.

        All my opinions and in the interest of working out the solution.

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        • #5
          It simply feels wrong to me for some reason, not very imaginative and like it’s being deliberately pushed like the gps solve, stinks of desperation for answers, sad really, sorry guys I’m not buying it one bit.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Must Listengood View Post
            A) Can you provide the exact quote/context of condor's post about "a few miles". I haven't seen that. Also when he said it may be important. 2018? Jack (or condor) was doing some speculating - he didn't have everything nailed down 100% - or at least he wasn't sure beyond a reasonable doubt until later, probably 2019.
            Yes, its from Rimbrock's 'Jack answers emails' database he posted a while back on this forum.

            Comment


            • #7
              Forrest said...
              The finder might not realize why the place was special to him...
              He removed the reason from his autobiography because it was too personal...
              If you don't have WWWH nailed down you don't have anything.....
              The treasure was most likely to be affected by wind....
              At the spot you might realize something that you hadn't known before....
              To the best of his knowledge no one had identified the correct HOB....

              Do any of these things apply to 9MH?

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Must Listengood View Post

                He hadn't finalized the location due to not knowing whether "home" meant the creek (spawning grounds of Brown trout) or whether home meant the "residence" of brown trout (9 mile hole itself). If it meant residence, then both lower and upper 9 mile hole was in play and his search area was much bigger. Jack talked about this. He was trying to narrow down the area, but for a while, the entire 9 mile hole area (both upper and lower) was in play. The fake blaze could easily be 1000 feet from the creek area during this period of his search. I believe that HOB is NOT 9 mile hole - it is the creek, the spawning ground of brown trout.
                Someone needs to draw a map of the Madison and highlight all the places brown trout live and spawn, that will surely help us nail down the real hoB.

                If this solve is right we've all wasted our time. Any solve with this level of imprecision about a major clue suggests Forrest was just playing with searchers. If this is right it means he made a treasure hunt that professed to work on its own, but actually needed slip-ups and days of search covering a large area. I still like to think this wasn't the solve, and we're missing something, but how can anyone who supports this as a solution think Forrest's poem and clues are a thoughtful and creative work that took years to devise?

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by MicDobbs View Post

                  Yes, its from Rimbrock's 'Jack answers emails' database he posted a while back on this forum.
                  OK. I looked that up. Here is Jack's quote: "I don't want to say that, but I will say Forrest only walked less than a few miles." I think that is a lot different than "Forrest probably walked a few miles." So I don't have any problem believing that quote from Jack.

                  "

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Sal O'mander View Post
                    Forrest said...
                    The finder might not realize why the place was special to him...
                    He removed the reason from his autobiography because it was too personal...
                    If you don't have WWWH nailed down you don't have anything.....
                    The treasure was most likely to be affected by wind....
                    At the spot you might realize something that you hadn't known before....
                    To the best of his knowledge no one had identified the correct HOB....

                    Do any of these things apply to 9MH?
                    I think they can all apply to a spot near the creek at 9MH.
                    I don't know what the quote "If you are at the right spot....." means. I sent an email to Jack and asked him if he could comment on that. He did not reply. I could only make some guesses.
                    On Forrest's statement about no one identifying the correct HOB, as I posted in another thread, I believe that is because no one told him the creek at 9MH was the HOB and no one had told him the correct definition of "home", meaning "place of origin" and with respect to fish means "spawning grounds". The HOB is the creek, not 9MH. In my opinion.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by tootingjo View Post

                      Someone needs to draw a map of the Madison and highlight all the places brown trout live and spawn, that will surely help us nail down the real hoB.

                      If this solve is right we've all wasted our time. Any solve with this level of imprecision about a major clue suggests Forrest was just playing with searchers. If this is right it means he made a treasure hunt that professed to work on its own, but actually needed slip-ups and days of search covering a large area. I still like to think this wasn't the solve, and we're missing something, but how can anyone who supports this as a solution think Forrest's poem and clues are a thoughtful and creative work that took years to devise?
                      I think if you highlight all the places trout spawn on the Madison inside the park, you might only come up with a few. I think the creek at 9MH was special - there aren't many creeks.

                      I don't think the treasure hunt required slip ups, but they obviously helped. I was surprised by the days of searching aspect also, but that appears to be one of the things that Forrest inserted in order to make it hard to find. And of course an apparent damaged blaze made it extremely hard.

                      Forrest kept emphasizing that the clues were straightforward. To get back in the box. To simplify. In retrospect, I think he tweaked the poem for 15 years. It only took that long because he kept refining it, not because it took that long to compose. I kind of feel the same as you that its a bit underwhelming, and maybe even disappointing. But my expectations are irrelevant. I can see how this spot would have been a special place/experience for him that lasted a lifetime, and designing a treasure hunt around it and trying to "think of everything" is probably a lot harder that it seems.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        [QUOTE=Must Listengood;n340245]
                        B) The fake blaze was likely across the Madison at lower 9 mile hole. He hadn't finalized the location due to not knowing whether "home" meant the creek (spawning grounds of Brown trout) or whether home meant the "residence" of brown trout (9 mile hole itself). If it meant residence, then both lower and upper 9 mile hole was in play and his search area was much bigger. Jack talked about this. He was trying to narrow down the area, but for a while, the entire 9 mile hole area (both upper and lower) was in play. The fake blaze could easily be 1000 feet from the creek area during this period of his search. I believe that HOB is NOT 9 mile hole - it is the creek, the spawning ground of brown trout.

                        Jack later decided to go with the creek as the spawning grounds and narrowed his search to the creek area. He may have focused his football field on the island, or perhaps an area that was about 200 feet back and 200 feet over from the creek based on other statements from Forrest.
                        /QUOTE]

                        Thanks Must Listengood. I thought it was you who first suggested hoB was the spawning ground up the creek but I couldn't find where you said it. Like you said, if the hoB was the spawning ground that could explain how Jack was the only person to tell Forrest the correct hoB. If the hoB was the fishing hole then it's hard to explain how Jack could have been the only person to tell this to Forrest.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by willynilly View Post
                          It simply feels wrong to me for some reason, not very imaginative and like it’s being deliberately pushed like the gps solve, stinks of desperation for answers, sad really, sorry guys I’m not buying it one bit.
                          I have to agree. There is something that is missing- the aha moment. You can’t forget that Forrest said everyone would laugh and say Why didn’t I think of that. When I emailed Jack and asked him if he had that moment. He said yes. I don’t see this at nine mile hole. It will be someplace a little more striking.

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                          • #14
                            He also mentioned boundaries all the time for a reason ... that’s doesn’t fit nine mile either...

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              From Bozeman Chronicle in 2008 by Forrest Fenn...
                              "Those great places on the Firehole, which were personal secrets to me then, are now busy with the flourish of fishermen and women who cast a midge or floating cadis upon the same waters, never knowing I had been there, or even caring yes or no. I always thought that space was mine alone, and many of the memories there bred are even now still so personal that they exclude the intrusion of strangers. How dare they do that?"

                              Listen, if Forrest was talking about the Firehole in Flywater in TTOTC, then why is everybody dismissing the Firehole where his most personal memories are? Yes he and family fished the Madison but he says it above, he fished the firehole alone. Those were his places back then. These memories along the Firehole were so sacred, he put it right before Gold And More (poem) in his memoir. I am on team Firehole. I believe Jack wrote about his stretch of the Madison while trying to rule out his other ideas, he is way too smart to openly discuss his solve area. I believe WWWH could still be Mad Junc. But I believe canyon down was Firehole Canyon south. I dont have a HOB locked down but I just dont feel an AHA with 9 mile. Besides, 9 mile is just one of several photos along the Madison that he included in his memoir (pg 123). None of the Firehole is included. He removed that name for a reason.

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