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  • A focused thought on Water High

    Let's talk about water high.

    Here's a watery fact (an absolutely real fact for those who like to throw their "facts" around):
    At 10,015 feet, Cumbres Pass (CO) is the highest mountain pass reached by rail in the United States.

    Below are the two stanzas that mention water. It's real water but it's not ordinary liquid water.
    WWWH refers to the steam locomotives of the C&T Scenic Railroad. They 'halt' for lunch at Osier, CO.
    Down below, on the Los Pinos river bank, you are standing at the CO/NM border (where you just put in below the home of Brown).
    Your elevation is 9,340 ft.
    The trains pass above you at 9,640 ft.
    The difference is 300 feet (9640 - 9340 = 300), a football field length. That's 300 feet above your punkin' head.
    Forrest chose to camouflage steam as water. It's perfectly correct to do this since they both still consist of molecules of H2O.
    Both of these water stanzas refer to the trains: 'wwwh' and 'heavy loads and water high.'
    All aboard!

    2.Begin it where warm waters halt
    And take it in the canyon down,
    Not far, but too far to walk.
    Put in below the home of Brown.

    3.From there it’s no place for the meek,
    The end is ever drawing nigh;
    There’ll be no paddle up your creek,
    Just heavy loads and water high.
    Begin it in the home of Brown where warm waters halt.

  • #2
    Originally posted by Old Pilot
    I suspect that your focus should be improved. The poem should, with no modification, be valid for thousands of years. In a thousand years, do you think that there will still be
    an operational steam-powered railroad at Cumbres Pass? Please remember that the poem doesn't refer to or depend on ancient history. Its frame of reference fits within the
    life span of a searcher. I'll allow up to 100 years for that; I feel generous. But there's one thing you should be asking yourself . . . do ya feel focused? Well, do ya . . . ?
    Here's something to focus on old pilot----how old are you?
    We might need a new one pretty soon----a young pilot, a young pilot for the new millennium.
    Please start sending out some want ads.

    As for a thousand-year-old treasure poem---hell no. It'll be forgotten in the bleak future of pandemics and climate change disasters.

    And here's a reasonable rational ending for the C&TS steam train.
    It may end for financial reasons, although there are lots of profitable steam train operations all across the country.
    But even if the company is dismantled and the track and the rails removed. its path through the mountains, chiseled out with sledge hammers, pick axes, and dynamite, will remain visible and usable for a very long time. Heck, future hikers and explorers will seek out the "Toltec Trail" for a 62-mile challenge through New Mexico & Colorado.
    They'll point out the treasure site as they pass through Osier and put in below the home of Brown.
    Begin it in the home of Brown where warm waters halt.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Old Pilot

      I suspect that your focus should be improved. The poem should, with no modification, be valid for thousands of years. In a thousand years, do you think that there will still be
      an operational steam-powered railroad at Cumbres Pass? Please remember that the poem doesn't refer to or depend on ancient history. Its frame of reference fits within the
      life span of a searcher. I'll allow up to 100 years for that; I feel generous. But there's one thing you should be asking yourself . . . do ya feel focused? Well, do ya . . . ?
      Maybe not focused but I do believe in lucky ducks....

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Old Pilot

        I saw some ducks in water high near heavy loads, near the location of the spot that my solve led me to. Every time I see the mention of ducks posted, I think I'm being teased by someone "in the know" about the correct solve. Well, maybe not 100% "in the know", but enough to know that duck(s) as a subject for consideration could help solve the poem. As always, all part of my opinion.
        I wouldn't lose your head over it, duck(s) are a global thing.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by larsonist View Post
          Let's talk about water high.

          Here's a watery fact (an absolutely real fact for those who like to throw their "facts" around):
          At 10,015 feet, Cumbres Pass (CO) is the highest mountain pass reached by rail in the United States.

          Below are the two stanzas that mention water. It's real water but it's not ordinary liquid water.
          WWWH refers to the steam locomotives of the C&T Scenic Railroad. They 'halt' for lunch at Osier, CO.
          Down below, on the Los Pinos river bank, you are standing at the CO/NM border (where you just put in below the home of Brown).
          Your elevation is 9,340 ft.
          The trains pass above you at 9,640 ft.
          The difference is 300 feet (9640 - 9340 = 300), a football field length. That's 300 feet above your punkin' head.
          Forrest chose to camouflage steam as water. It's perfectly correct to do this since they both still consist of molecules of H2O.
          Both of these water stanzas refer to the trains: 'wwwh' and 'heavy loads and water high.'
          All aboard!

          2.Begin it where warm waters halt
          And take it in the canyon down,
          Not far, but too far to walk.
          Put in below the home of Brown.

          3.From there it’s no place for the meek,
          The end is ever drawing nigh;
          There’ll be no paddle up your creek,
          Just heavy loads and water high.
          I’ll call your bluff and raise you!

          keep it simple, straightforward, and not mess around.

          forrest said the clues would allow him to put one foot down then take another step, something like that. The exact words don’t really matter, there’s no hint in it, just think. Each clue is connected to the one that comes before it.

          -there’ll be no paddle up your creek, just heavy loads and water high.

          theres 2 clues There, and heavy loads and water high is in reference to no paddle up your creek. Be logical, don’t try and think out of the box. No paddle up your creek. It’s a dry creak bed. What’s in a dry creek bed? River rocks or heavy loads. If you were to remove some of the rocks, what would you find? A high water table.

          simple, straight forward and to the point.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Imeverybodynow View Post

            I’ll call your bluff and raise you!

            keep it simple, straightforward, and not mess around.

            forrest said the clues would allow him to put one foot down then take another step, something like that. The exact words don’t really matter, there’s no hint in it, just think. Each clue is connected to the one that comes before it.

            -there’ll be no paddle up your creek, just heavy loads and water high.

            theres 2 clues There, and heavy loads and water high is in reference to no paddle up your creek. Be logical, don’t try and think out of the box. No paddle up your creek. It’s a dry creak bed. What’s in a dry creek bed? River rocks or heavy loads. If you were to remove some of the rocks, what would you find? A high water table.

            simple, straight forward and to the point.
            This gave me that sinking feeling...

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Imeverybodynow View Post

              I’ll call your bluff and raise you!

              keep it simple, straightforward, and not mess around.

              forrest said the clues would allow him to put one foot down then take another step, something like that. The exact words don’t really matter, there’s no hint in it, just think. Each clue is connected to the one that comes before it.

              -there’ll be no paddle up your creek, just heavy loads and water high.

              theres 2 clues There, and heavy loads and water high is in reference to no paddle up your creek. Be logical, don’t try and think out of the box. No paddle up your creek. It’s a dry creak bed. What’s in a dry creek bed? River rocks or heavy loads. If you were to remove some of the rocks, what would you find? A high water table.

              simple, straight forward and to the point.
              There should be springs near the hiding spot, creating a lush vegetation. Springs are a logic consequence of high ground water levels. Under the springs you have a real creek, above the springs you still have water high, but no possibility to paddle up the (dry) creekbed).

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Round Peg, Square Hole View Post

                This gave me that sinking feeling...
                What do you mean??


                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by jan_v60 View Post

                  There should be springs near the hiding spot, creating a lush vegetation. Springs are a logic consequence of high ground water levels. Under the springs you have a real creek, above the springs you still have water high, but no possibility to paddle up the (dry) creekbed).
                  why does there have to be a spring? Think about what the poem says… take it in the canyon down… it never says to leave the canyon, so if we’re in the mountains and there’s snow melt or rainfall (which is everyday with mid day thunderstorms in the Rockies) , and it cascades down into the canyon, and there’s a creek that traverses the bottom of the canyon…. Never mind, I’ll just let you ponder the what if’s… lol

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Old Pilot

                    I suspect that your focus should be improved. The poem should, with no modification, be valid for thousands of years. In a thousand years, do you think that there will still be
                    an operational steam-powered railroad at Cumbres Pass? Please remember that the poem doesn't refer to or depend on ancient history. Its frame of reference fits within the
                    life span of a searcher. I'll allow up to 100 years for that; I feel generous. But there's one thing you should be asking yourself . . . do ya feel focused? Well, do ya . . . ?
                    Forrest said:
                    The clues did not exist when I was a kid but most of the places the clues refer to did. I think they might still exist in 100 years but the geography probably will change before we reach the next millennia. The Rocky mountains are still moving and associated physical changes will surely have an impact. If you are in the year 3,009 it will be more difficult for you to find the treasure.f

                    My question:
                    does this mean the clues are the names linked to places. And taken strictly none of the clues (names) existed in 1930-1945 (when he was a kid) and only most (not all) of the places existed ?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Right next to heavy loads, where it's expected to remain for many centuries to come.

                      Click image for larger version

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                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by larsonist View Post

                        Here's something to focus on old pilot----how old are you?
                        We might need a new one pretty soon----a young pilot, a young pilot for the new millennium.
                        Please start sending out some want ads.

                        As for a thousand-year-old treasure poem---hell no. It'll be forgotten in the bleak future of pandemics and climate change disasters.

                        And here's a reasonable rational ending for the C&TS steam train.
                        It may end for financial reasons, although there are lots of profitable steam train operations all across the country.
                        But even if the company is dismantled and the track and the rails removed. its path through the mountains, chiseled out with sledge hammers, pick axes, and dynamite, will remain visible and usable for a very long time. Heck, future hikers and explorers will seek out the "Toltec Trail" for a 62-mile challenge through New Mexico & Colorado.
                        They'll point out the treasure site as they pass through Osier and put in below the home of Brown.
                        Lars, you are exactly right. The San Lazaro Pueblo has been “gone” for a few hundred years yet it’s still there.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Yellerstain View Post

                          Lars, you are exactly right. The San Lazaro Pueblo has been “gone” for a few hundred years yet it’s still there.
                          Abracadabra

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Old Pilot

                            I saw some ducks in water high near heavy loads, near the location of the spot that my solve led me to. Every time I see the mention of ducks posted, I think I'm being teased by someone "in the know" about the correct solve. Well, maybe not 100% "in the know", but enough to know that duck(s) as a subject for consideration could help solve the poem. As always, all part of my opinion.
                            Op- Good one ..Tired.
                            Say, when you saw those ducks, were any of them diving?
                            Now don't duck answering my question. Thank you in advance for your answer.
                            I have lots of questions. Lots more.
                            1f Billy

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Knight
                              Since Forrest writes so often about his bathroom and shower it occurs to me that warm water ends where his grout fungus begins.
                              His crack?

                              Comment

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