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  • #31
    Don't wait for gov-corp, use something washable like 2 bandannas at a time.
    Questing song:
    The Beatles "I'll Be Back"
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2K9Ij6VmOD4

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    • #32
      Dryer sheets and bale in wire

      Comment


      • #33
        Many people have home 3-D printers, and with proper request, could be mobilized to help make a particular part (be it the nose bridge or a reusable base to hold replaceable filters.) The plastic filament isn’t cheap and would be coming from personal supplies of it- but many parts could be made and mailed to one location and then sterilized.

        similar concept with oxygen mask valve parts:
        https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbc...mp/ncna1165026

        Comment


        • #34
          What are HEPA vacuum filters made from?

          HEPA media is going to get you close to what is needed.

          In theory, you could use very thin sheet metal discs for filters in a cartridge-type mask if you could machine holes in those disks that are of the appropriate smallness in diameter AND densely enough packed together with a minimum of spacing between the holes. EDM machining is how such tiny holes are machined in fuel injectors so in theory, the process is doable.

          But in practice, the challenge is refining the EDM machining technique to efficiently consistently blast around a million microscopically small holes per inch in a sheet of metal that is about as thick as aluminum foil. The benefits would be a filter media that would have a longer useful lifespan and could possibly be cleaned for reuse several times.

          Understand that the size of the hole is what would exclude the virus from passing through EDM metal filter media, but it is the density of how closely those holes are packed together that determine the resistance to airflow. If the spacing between the holes is too wide, it will be difficult to draw enough air from an EDM filter screen or disk to breathe. But if the holes are packed closely enough together, there will be much less resistance to flow. The size or area required of such an EDM produced filter element would depend on the amount of filtered airflow required and the resistance to that flow a particular EDM produced media poses.

          Also, understand that such EDM produced media would be very expensive at first because there would be no initial economy of scale, but if metal that is resistant to corrosion is selected, EDM filter media could be stored for years, even centuries, and would be one of the best methods of stockpiling filter media for future pandemics. So while this EDM suggestion would likely have no benefit to the current crisis, it is something that should be investigated when this current pandemic has passed.

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          • #35
            After reading it seems like the key is the fit to the face/pressure test (obvious I guess but it is easy to focus on the filtration only) so I assume the mask ring itself has to be sturdy enough to hold up to pressure, but flexible enough to mold to the face. You all probably already knew that. There also may be some historical value in looking at tuberculosis interventions.

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            • #36
              One other source- long shot- pet pee pads. They’re standard sizes but volume might be the question...

              Also whatever that wire is they use in Easter egg dipper spoons- that stuff would be ideal.

              sorry- pets and kids...
              Last edited by JHSharp; 03-23-2020, 11:47 AM.

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by JHSharp View Post
                After reading it seems like the key is the fit to the face/pressure test (obvious I guess but it is easy to focus on the filtration only) so I assume the mask ring itself has to be sturdy enough to hold up to pressure, but flexible enough to mold to the face. You all probably already knew that. There also may be some historical value in looking at tuberculosis interventions.
                Hi there- sorry guys..im back
                Yes the issue is a balance between breathability and filtration.
                If you cant breath into something for 10 hours straight, it won't work....

                I just got off the phone with a filtration researcher in non woven materials...
                he says- "we've been waiting for the call" our MELTBLOWN machine is ready...
                like y'all- this is better than finding gold right now.

                unbelievable ...

                the landscaping crop cover is really good and Im putting together a package to overnight him to test.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by JHSharp View Post
                  After reading it seems like the key is the fit to the face/pressure test (obvious I guess but it is easy to focus on the filtration only) so I assume the mask ring itself has to be sturdy enough to hold up to pressure, but flexible enough to mold to the face. You all probably already knew that. There also may be some historical value in looking at tuberculosis interventions.
                  yes! TB is highly contagious...smart idea!

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by LurkerMike View Post
                    What are HEPA vacuum filters made from?

                    HEPA media is going to get you close to what is needed.

                    In theory, you could use very thin sheet metal discs for filters in a cartridge-type mask if you could machine holes in those disks that are of the appropriate smallness in diameter AND densely enough packed together with a minimum of spacing between the holes. EDM machining is how such tiny holes are machined in fuel injectors so in theory, the process is doable.

                    But in practice, the challenge is refining the EDM machining technique to efficiently consistently blast around a million microscopically small holes per inch in a sheet of metal that is about as thick as aluminum foil. The benefits would be a filter media that would have a longer useful lifespan and could possibly be cleaned for reuse several times.

                    Understand that the size of the hole is what would exclude the virus from passing through EDM metal filter media, but it is the density of how closely those holes are packed together that determine the resistance to airflow. If the spacing between the holes is too wide, it will be difficult to draw enough air from an EDM filter screen or disk to breathe. But if the holes are packed closely enough together, there will be much less resistance to flow. The size or area required of such an EDM produced filter element would depend on the amount of filtered airflow required and the resistance to that flow a particular EDM produced media poses.

                    Also, understand that such EDM produced media would be very expensive at first because there would be no initial economy of scale, but if metal that is resistant to corrosion is selected, EDM filter media could be stored for years, even centuries, and would be one of the best methods of stockpiling filter media for future pandemics. So while this EDM suggestion would likely have no benefit to the current crisis, it is something that should be investigated when this current pandemic has passed.
                    that is fascinating.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Rose Livingstone View Post
                      Many people have home 3-D printers, and with proper request, could be mobilized to help make a particular part (be it the nose bridge or a reusable base to hold replaceable filters.) The plastic filament isn’t cheap and would be coming from personal supplies of it- but many parts could be made and mailed to one location and then sterilized.

                      similar concept with oxygen mask valve parts:
                      https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nbc...mp/ncna1165026
                      100k pcs of 5mm x 1mm aluminum at 4 "...with rounded edges.
                      Maybe I should ask trump? he can make a tweet about it?

                      not being snotty, just feeling helpless.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by willynilly
                        I just spoke with a fabric store (head office is open) they were terrified with the prospect of assisting with any type of medical grade mask filtering project. The woman didn’t even try to think outside the box, people are terrified of being sued is what it boils down to. I hope you can get your hands on something useful.
                        yes. but the doctors do not care.
                        in the hospitals, this is war.
                        they are going start letting people die.
                        so, all the codes and standards have been lifted in medical professions.
                        Im serious- this was given to me by the hospital.

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by JHSharp View Post
                          Armature/picture wire might do it, if not light duty.
                          yes this is good- Home Depot sells too...
                          we worry about the sharp edges tho...not sure we ill have time to hammer and file

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by ultrasharp sunshine View Post
                            Dryer sheets and bale in wire
                            maybe if you washed 6 and dried together.
                            this is called lace bond...its like a very open weave of non woven.
                            doesn't offer much but if layered with cotton maybe. just dont make yourself sick with scents

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                            • #44
                              I don't know if this material would fit your spec needs. But when you buy a Purple Brand Mattress they come wrapped in a cover that is similar to a weedblock. Pretty tough material and you can breath through it. (we kept ours and have used it for years to catch the mess we make when we split wood). Was wondering if other fabrics used in traditional mattress construction might work as well.

                              Here is a link to a video that shows the wrapping and Purples Corporate headquarters are in Utah.

                              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UvQ8M57IhF4

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Spallies View Post
                                I don't know if this material would fit your spec needs. But when you buy a Purple Brand Mattress they come wrapped in a cover that is similar to a weedblock. Pretty tough material and you can breath through it. (we kept ours and have used it for years to catch the mess we make when we split wood). Was wondering if other fabrics used in traditional mattress construction might work as well.

                                Here is a link to a video that shows the wrapping and Purples Corporate headquarters are in Utah.

                                https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UvQ8M57IhF4
                                Emailing them now- thank you

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