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  • The Cross

    The cross from Whiterock overlook is the same shape as the cross Fenn drew in the visiting CWB doodle. Even down to the semi circle below the arms of the cross.
    He drew these after I told him I gave up on the actual BOTG searching which is why the second doodle has the searcher missing.

    At the 45 minute mark you can see the cross better up close.

    https://youtu.be/pFIZQP4XfmA

    I hope someone can find it.
    Attached Files

  • #2
    From that cross you can see the road Eric Sloane lived off of. You will see the alligator across the river. It's next to Ox Canyon (bessie). Its next to Mortality canyon (dying wish). It's next to the three forgotten waterfalls, now their beauty stripped away when they added the sewage disposal creek (up poo creek without a paddle).

    There are pinon pines surrounding the area and plenty of wildlife. You could sit and watch the river while you eat your sandwich. Its nearly 1/4 mile from the rio grande (not near). The wwwh is based on the nm fishing regulations at the 502 bridge located in los alamos canyon (the atomic bomb). It is directly on the flight path for landing into los alamos airport, we saw 4 or 5 planes fly over head, Fenn would fly through this canyon anytime he flew North.

    This explains the older version of the poem, if you've been wise and found the stones just take the chest and leave my bones.

    The cross is 472 ft from the overlook. Many people would stand there not knowing it was there.

    This is how the searcher will make all the lines cross at the right spot.

    The cross is Fenn's church in the mountains.

    Fenn if you're reading this I hope you're not mad I'm giving it away, and since I'm refraining from email I'll say it here. I hope you know I'm only posting all this so someone can find the treasure that I wasn't able to find. I hope I'm not adding to the list of disappointments like your home in Temple and your schools growing up. If someone finds it soon I want you to be able to see your bracelet again and get to go out there one last time.

    Sorry to any searchers who are getting tired of my posts but I want to share all I have in hopes that whoever can find the treasure will have loved the chase as much as me.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Dryw2015 View Post
      From that cross you can see the road Eric Sloane lived off of. You will see the alligator across the river. It's next to Ox Canyon (bessie). Its next to Mortality canyon (dying wish). It's next to the three forgotten waterfalls, now their beauty stripped away when they added the sewage disposal creek (up poo creek without a paddle).

      There are pinon pines surrounding the area and plenty of wildlife. You could sit and watch the river while you eat your sandwich. Its nearly 1/4 mile from the rio grande (not near). The wwwh is based on the nm fishing regulations at the 502 bridge located in los alamos canyon (the atomic bomb).
      There are enough things wrong with what you've written above and earlier that I don't know quite where to begin. One big takeaway is that so much of what you've written is critically dependent on resources outside the poem: Eric Sloane, Edith Warner's Tea House, alligator + Otowi Peak being called "gator hill" by locals, Bessie (ox?? huh?), waterfalls, pinon pines, Spanish language knowledge, NM fishing regulations and Los Alamos/A-bomb. You made other statements that simply aren't true, such as "The saying strong as an ox would be the opposite of meek." Horses are meek, sheep are meek, but neither are weak. For that matter, oxen are meek: they are tame and submissive.

      Fenn isn't mad at you giving anything away because you've given nothing away. You've latched onto specialized knowledge in the form of NM fishing regulations which has attracted you to the wrong state, IMO. You then skirt with contradicting Forrest by having a solution that is "close" to the Rio Grande by any reasonable definition. I could also argue that your area is a desert -- another Forrest contradiction. Everything from that point on is confirmation bias. Here's what Forrest would tell you: go back to the poem and the first clue. I don't think you've nailed down a solid, specific WWWH, and until you do you've got nothing.

      I missed AGK the night you were on, so I'm curious what Toby & Shelley's reaction was to your solution? While Toby is back to being focused on NM (to his detriment, after being much closer in Montana), he is nevertheless logical and probably had some of the same objections that I do.

      Some questions to ask yourself: If that cross is your location of where your quest is to cease, how could you argue that Google Earth can't help with the last clue? How long has that cross been there? More importantly, how long WILL it be there? Do you think it'll last 100 years? 1000 years? Could you make two round trips in several hours from your car to that location carrying over 20 lbs. on each of the uphill legs? Could a 79-year-old man? How do you respond to Forrest's claim that an 80-year-old man isn't going to go down and up and down and up a canyon?

      It just seems to me that you are drawn to this big X, and are trying to reverse engineer clues to support it.

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Zapster View Post

        There are enough things wrong with what you've written above and earlier that I don't know quite where to begin. One big takeaway is that so much of what you've written is critically dependent on resources outside the poem: Eric Sloane, Edith Warner's Tea House, alligator + Otowi Peak being called "gator hill" by locals, Bessie (ox?? huh?), waterfalls, pinon pines, Spanish language knowledge, NM fishing regulations and Los Alamos/A-bomb. You made other statements that simply aren't true, such as "The saying strong as an ox would be the opposite of meek." Horses are meek, sheep are meek, but neither are weak. For that matter, oxen are meek: they are tame and submissive.

        Fenn isn't mad at you giving anything away because you've given nothing away. You've latched onto specialized knowledge in the form of NM fishing regulations which has attracted you to the wrong state, IMO. You then skirt with contradicting Forrest by having a solution that is "close" to the Rio Grande by any reasonable definition. I could also argue that your area is a desert -- another Forrest contradiction. Everything from that point on is confirmation bias. Here's what Forrest would tell you: go back to the poem and the first clue. I don't think you've nailed down a solid, specific WWWH, and until you do you've got nothing.

        I missed AGK the night you were on, so I'm curious what Toby & Shelley's reaction was to your solution? While Toby is back to being focused on NM (to his detriment, after being much closer in Montana), he is nevertheless logical and probably had some of the same objections that I do.

        Some questions to ask yourself: If that cross is your location of where your quest is to cease, how could you argue that Google Earth can't help with the last clue? How long has that cross been there? More importantly, how long WILL it be there? Do you think it'll last 100 years? 1000 years? Could you make two round trips in several hours from your car to that location carrying over 20 lbs. on each of the uphill legs? Could a 79-year-old man? How do you respond to Forrest's claim that an 80-year-old man isn't going to go down and up and down and up a canyon?

        It just seems to me that you are drawn to this big X, and are trying to reverse engineer clues to support it.
        Do you have any idea why he would have drawn a cross that looks exactly like the one I shared then?

        I've been reading solves here for a while and never gave any much thought so I get that you don't think the solve is right but I found all the clues before looking into all the scrapbooks and interviews. But after two years on the same solve I've been able to connect the hints to the clues in my solve. It could be confirmation bias or it could be just confirmation.

        This has been the only solve I have had since day one. I've shared the emails I sent Forrest and the responses he has sent. Not many average joe searchers like myself have ever received an email response from Forrest and I have shared multiple. Each one with one of the clue locations.

        Comment


        • #5
          Dryw2015: a cross is an extremely basic shape. I would attach no significance to it, just as I wouldn't to any circle, triangle, square, or rectangle. The only thing that impresses me is a WWWH that is specific and can be 100% derived from the poem.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by Zapster View Post
            Dryw2015: a cross is an extremely basic shape. I would attach no significance to it, just as I wouldn't to any circle, triangle, square, or rectangle. The only thing that impresses me is a WWWH that is specific and can be 100% derived from the poem.
            Have you been impressed by a WWWH that is specific and can be 100% derived from the poem? So far, I haven't. But I think I have a workable WWWH anyway. And I used to read about
            Huey, Dewey, and Louie.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Old Pilot View Post

              Have you been impressed by a WWWH that is specific and can be 100% derived from the poem? So far, I haven't. But I think I have a workable WWWH anyway. And I used to read about
              Huey, Dewey, and Louie.
              You worry me! On two counts...

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Old Pilot View Post

                Have you been impressed by a WWWH that is specific and can be 100% derived from the poem?
                In a word, yes.
                Originally posted by Old Pilot View Post
                So far, I haven't. But I think I have a workable WWWH anyway. And I used to read about
                Huey, Dewey, and Louie.
                A triplet of ducks is an excellent start, especially if you use Angelo, Barney, and Tail End Charlie.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Zapster View Post
                  In a word, yes.

                  A triplet of ducks is an excellent start, especially if you use Angelo, Barney, and Tail End Charlie.
                  M R ducks. M R not ducks. O S A R, C D E D B D wings? L I B, M R ducks!
                  Miles up in the air he flew, He just murmured, Toodle-oo!
                  Righty-O!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Zapster View Post
                    In a word, yes.

                    A triplet of ducks is an excellent start, especially if you use Angelo, Barney, and Tail End Charlie.
                    Y I B CB
                    "If you think it could not have been put there, your probably right. f " https://youtu.be/St6jyEFe5WM

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Scrapbook 233:
                      Charmay was a good friend and trusted digging companion. She excavated the beautiful emerald cross that I found with a metal detector at San Lazaro.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Dryw2015 View Post
                        Scrapbook 233:
                        Charmay was a good friend and trusted digging companion. She excavated the beautiful emerald cross that I found with a metal detector at San Lazaro.
                        Ha - he located it and she did the work! Now isn't that so typical?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I like the cross pic. Very dynamic visually. But in my opinion when Forrest said not near the Rio Grande. The knowledge was known it's in one of 4 states. So looking at the "big picture". The official map from the second book. I would say draw a lines 30 miles on each side of the Rio Grande. And eliminate it. I've said from the beginnings. The community needs to work together with factual information and process of elimination to stop chasing our own tales...
                          i believe there are at least 4 areas ff has eliminated. And a few geographic one. But i don't keep good notes.
                          Facts;
                          Not near the Rio Grande
                          Not in the dessert
                          North of Sante Fe. South of Canada.
                          He never heard of that one shrine.
                          etc.
                          Does any one have a detailed list of geographic eliminsted places they would list?
                          To me it's the best way to not get caught up in conformation bias.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Sunburnt1 View Post
                            I like the cross pic. Very dynamic visually. But in my opinion when Forrest said not near the Rio Grande. The knowledge was known it's in one of 4 states. So looking at the "big picture". The official map from the second book. I would say draw a lines 30 miles on each side of the Rio Grande. And eliminate it. I've said from the beginnings. The community needs to work together with factual information and process of elimination to stop chasing our own tales...
                            i believe there are at least 4 areas ff has eliminated. And a few geographic one. But i don't keep good notes.
                            Facts;
                            Not near the Rio Grande
                            Not in the dessert
                            North of Sante Fe. South of Canada.
                            He never heard of that one shrine.
                            etc.
                            Does any one have a detailed list of geographic eliminsted places they would list?
                            To me it's the best way to not get caught up in conformation bias.
                            He also said not near a human trail. So I definitely see your logic in using the big picture to rule out certain states which the Rio Grande flows through, however, we don't also rule out areas with human trails nearby.

                            I define near to Forrest Fenn as less than 500ft. He has said many people have been within 500ft of the treasure. To me this must mean that there is a human trail, whether literal trail or a road, within 500ft of the treasure. If the treasure was located father than 500ft from the closest trail, Forrest would need to know of an area where many people, not searchers, get off the trail which would be much harder to determine. Not to mention "many people" being that close would overtime create a trail. With this in mind I look at the distance between the Rio Grande and the cross above and find it is 1500ft as the crow flies from the Rio Grande, much more when altitude change is taken into account.

                            This area, part of bandelier, would not be considered desert. There are large pines and pinon pine as well as flowing waterfalls.

                            Attached Files

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              The Bandelier area does have a lot going for it. And i agree my 30 mile statement could be way off. I make that statement off of a comment i say when someone asks where i live in is. . I take the closest well known large city. And i say near it. Which in fact is over 30 miles away. So if ff told me the treasure was near say a small location like like Fort Union NM. I would only search that 30mile stretch of the Rocky Mountains. But if he said it was near Denver. I would draw a 100mile circle around Denver as my focal point.

                              Comment

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