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  • RahRah
    started a topic Imagination and Knowledge

    Imagination and Knowledge

    “The first clue in the poem is ‘Begin it where warm waters halt’. That’s the first clue. If you can’t figure that clue out, you don’t have anything.”

    “The most common mistake that I see searchers make is that they underestimate the importance of the first clue. If you don’t have that one nailed down you might as well stay home and play Canasta.”

    “If a person reads the poem over and over…and are able to decipher the first few clues in the poem, they can find the treasure chest. It may not be easy, but it certainly isn’t impossible. I could go right straight to it.”

  • RahRah
    replied
    I'll provide an example - in TTOTC, Fenn writes, "If Robert Redford had ever written anything he probably could have done it better than the guy who wrote that Gatsby book."

    Shortly after that he wrote, "What do you think? But I’d have to tell everything straight because nothing is worse than facts written wrong. Just because Napoleon said that history was nothing more than fables agreed upon, doesn’t mean it’s true."

    I've emphasized the "facts written wrong" part because in the above, we have two glaring examples of "facts written wrong" and we all know this because we have all either looked to see if Robert Redford wrote a book and if Napoleon really said that. If we didn't look it up ourselves, we found posts by others who have to confirm one is wrong and the other is inaccurate - a half-truth (Napoleon said something to the effect - direct translation isn't a match - Napoleon was an important popularizer of the saying although he disclaimed coinage.)

    So we KNOW these are wrong, either wholly or in part.

    WHY?

    In solving the poem, are we to accept the inaccurate or wrong information because as it is in its incorrect or inaccurate state, that is how we use it in solving the poem.....or are we to correct or know the incorrect or inaccurate and use the corrected understanding in our solution?



    Leave a comment:


  • RahRah
    replied
    "Excellent research materials are TTOTC, Google Earth, and/or a good map."

    I don't know about others here, but it's been quite awhile since I did a research project in school - decades.

    Primary Sources
    A primary source provides direct or firsthand evidence about an event, object, person, or work of art.

    Examples of primary sources:
    Autobiographies and memoirs
    Diaries, personal letters, and correspondence
    Interviews, surveys, and fieldwork
    Internet communications on email, blogs, listservs, and newsgroups
    Photographs, drawings, and posters
    Works of art and literature
    Books, magazine and newspaper articles and ads published at the time
    Public opinion polls
    Speeches and oral histories
    Original documents (birth certificates, property deeds, trial transcripts)
    Research data, such as census statistics
    Official and unofficial records of organizations and government agencies
    Artifacts of all kinds, such as tools, coins, clothing, furniture, etc.
    Audio recordings, DVDs, and video recordings
    Government documents (reports, bills, proclamations, hearings, etc.)
    Patents
    Technical reports
    Scientific journal articles reporting experimental research results

    Within TTOTC we have a variety of "primary sources" that Fenn included, along with a number of additional things he's added outside TTOTC (scrapbooks, vignettes, additional books written to supplement TTOTC, interviews, etc.).

    So then, what is "research"?

    RESEARCH (noun)
    1
    : careful or diligent search : a close searching
    2
    a : studious inquiry or examination; especially : critical and exhaustive investigation or experimentation having for its aim the discovery of new facts and their correct interpretation, the revision of accepted conclusions, theories, or laws in the light of newly discovered facts, or the practical applications of such new or revised conclusions, theories, or laws
    b (1) : a particular investigation of such a character : a piece of research (2) : a presentation (as an article or book) incorporating the findings of a particular research
    3
    : capacity for or inclination to research

    RESEARCH (verb)
    transitive verb
    : to search or investigate exhaustively : make researches into
    intransitive verb
    : to make researches or investigations

    When you begin to research something, you start first with your subject. When given an assignment in school, you start with your subject, then bone up on the basics with reference materials to give you an overview (big picture) of your subject. From there, you delve in to the more detailed information from other sources, both primary and secondary, to build your understanding and bring together information to write your paper and make your argument.

    We're not writing a paper, we're solving a poem. Our project is the poem - we are searching for a solution to the poem. TTOTC is our reference book, along with Google Earth and/or a good map.

    Everything you need to find the treasure is in the poem, but everything you need to solve the poem is not in TTOTC....you have to research with the baseline information Fenn has provided us in TTOTC to connect the dots (so to speak) and solve the poem.

    Leave a comment:


  • lowkey
    replied
    Originally posted by Old Pilot View Post

    How pleasant is the experience for you?
    Well, my adventures out in the Chase BOTG are a solid 11 outta 10. My adventures in the blogs are a cool way to kill time in between BOTG. But Pilot, the mountains are always calling

    Leave a comment:


  • khan
    replied
    TR is fabulous lit. I've read it 50 times. It's 100% f. He's kewl because there's no x, something's never been found perhaps in ttotc history, more likely a reference to find the map, but then only finder could find it, sad.

    Leave a comment:


  • Covert One
    replied
    Originally posted by lowkey View Post
    You find anything you might find relevant in Catcher In The Rye?
    Damn rain.....you see.

    Leave a comment:


  • Old Pilot
    replied
    Originally posted by lowkey View Post
    I feel my sanity slipping away as I check the blogs 4 times a day
    How pleasant is the experience for you?

    Leave a comment:


  • lowkey
    replied
    I feel my sanity slipping away as I check the blogs 4 times a day

    Leave a comment:


  • lowkey
    replied
    Originally posted by RahRah View Post

    Among other things, yes, that is partly why I found the quote interesting and am paying more attention to the Important Literature chapter, piecing things together.
    Ok, cool. You find anything you might find relevant in Catcher In The Rye? I found Holden's slow descent into madness fascinating but that's about the only thing I could apply to the chase. lol

    Leave a comment:


  • RahRah
    replied
    Originally posted by lowkey View Post
    Cardboard soles, The VC detainee wearing shoes made outta used tires. Put's things into perspective, right?
    Among other things, yes, that is partly why I found the quote interesting and am paying more attention to the Important Literature chapter, piecing things together.

    Leave a comment:


  • lowkey
    replied
    Cardboard soles, The VC detainee wearing shoes made outta used tires. Put's things into perspective, right?

    Leave a comment:


  • lowkey
    replied
    Originally posted by RahRah View Post
    One of the most perceptive essays F. Scott Fitzgerald wrote, was “Early Success.” Three years after it was published, he was dead at 44.

    Snippet:
    The compensation of a very early success is a conviction that life is a romantic matter. In the best sense one stays young. When the primary objects of love and money could be taken for granted and a shaky eminence had lost its fascination, I had fairy years to waste, years that I can’t honestly regret, in seeking the eternal Carnival by the Sea. Once in the middle twenties I was driving along the High Corniche Road through the twilight with the whole French Riviera twinkling on the sea below. As far ahead as I could see was Monte Carlo, and though it was out of season and there were no Grand Dukes left to gamble and E. Phillips Oppenheim was a fat industrious man in my hotel, who lived in a bathrobe — the very name was so incorrigibly enchanting that I could only stop the car and like the Chinese whisper: “Ah me! Ah me!” It was not Monte Carlo I was looking at. It was back into the mind of the young man with cardboard soles who had walked the streets of New York. I was him again — for an instant I had the good fortune to share his dreams, I who had no more dreams of my own. And there are still times when I creep up on him, surprise him on an autumn morning in New York or a spring night in Carolina when it is so quiet that you can hear a dog barking in the next county. But never again during that all too short period when he and I were one person, when the fulfilled future and the wistful past were mingled in a single gorgeous moment — when life was literally a dream.

    https://www.jstor.org/stable/2636585...n_tab_contents
    Great quote RahRah. It seems he is speaking of living vicariously through his younger self. What he coveted was time and his youth, the freedom he had of being unburdened and just following his dreams.

    Leave a comment:


  • RahRah
    replied
    Thunderrose thinks Fenn is KEWL.

    By the 1920s, the word “cool” had changed from being associated solely with temperature to a term of appreciation.

    In 1924, Anna Lee Chisholm recorded Cool Kind Daddy Blues, and Zora Neale Hurston, in her short story The Gilded Six-Bits, wrote of a male character: “And whut make it so cool, he got money ‘cumulated. And womens give it all to ‘im.”

    When he came to write The Great Gatsby, F. Scott Fitzgerald knew that the alluring masculinity of Gatsby was summed up by “cool”:

    “Who wants to go to town?” demanded Daisy insistently.
    Gatsby’s eyes floated toward her.
    “Ah,” she cried, “you look so cool.”
    Their eyes met, and they stared together at each other, alone in space. With an effort she glanced down at the table.
    “You always look so cool,” she repeated.
    She had told him that she loved him, and Tom Buchanan saw. His mouth opened a little and he looked at Gatsby and then back at Daisy as if he had just recognized her as someone he knew a long time ago.”

    Leave a comment:


  • RahRah
    replied
    One of the most perceptive essays F. Scott Fitzgerald wrote, was “Early Success.” Three years after it was published, he was dead at 44.

    Snippet:
    The compensation of a very early success is a conviction that life is a romantic matter. In the best sense one stays young. When the primary objects of love and money could be taken for granted and a shaky eminence had lost its fascination, I had fairy years to waste, years that I can’t honestly regret, in seeking the eternal Carnival by the Sea. Once in the middle twenties I was driving along the High Corniche Road through the twilight with the whole French Riviera twinkling on the sea below. As far ahead as I could see was Monte Carlo, and though it was out of season and there were no Grand Dukes left to gamble and E. Phillips Oppenheim was a fat industrious man in my hotel, who lived in a bathrobe — the very name was so incorrigibly enchanting that I could only stop the car and like the Chinese whisper: “Ah me! Ah me!” It was not Monte Carlo I was looking at. It was back into the mind of the young man with cardboard soles who had walked the streets of New York. I was him again — for an instant I had the good fortune to share his dreams, I who had no more dreams of my own. And there are still times when I creep up on him, surprise him on an autumn morning in New York or a spring night in Carolina when it is so quiet that you can hear a dog barking in the next county. But never again during that all too short period when he and I were one person, when the fulfilled future and the wistful past were mingled in a single gorgeous moment — when life was literally a dream.

    https://www.jstor.org/stable/2636585...n_tab_contents

    Leave a comment:


  • RahRah
    replied
    The Great Gatsby:

    Fitzgerald’s work captures the evaporating memory of the American Eden while connecting it to the advent of the New World of smartness and thuggery and corruption. It was his rite of passage; it is our bridge to the time before “dreams” were slogans. He wanted to call it Among the Ashheaps and Millionaires — thank heaven that his editor, Maxwell Perkins, talked him out of it. It was nearly entitled just plain Gatsby. It remains “the great” because it confronts the defeat of youth and beauty and idealism, and finds the defeat unbearable, and then turns to face the defeat unflinchingly. With The Great Gatsby, American letters grew up.
    -Christopher Hitchens
    https://www.vanityfair.com/culture/p...s-great-gatsby

    Leave a comment:

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