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  • #91
    Originally posted by voxpops View Post
    From Wikipedia:

    Alan Mathison Turing OBE FRS (/ˈtjʊərɪŋ/; 23 June 1912 – 7 June 1954) was an English mathematician, computer scientist, logician, cryptanalyst, philosopher, and theoretical biologist.[6] Turing was highly influential in the development of theoretical computer science, providing a formalisation of the concepts of algorithm and computation with the Turing machine, which can be considered a model of a general-purpose computer.[7][8][9] He is widely considered to be the father of theoretical computer science and artificial intelligence.[10]

    ........

    Turing was prosecuted in 1952 for homosexual acts. He accepted hormone treatment with DES, a procedure commonly referred to as chemical castration, as an alternative to prison. Turing died on 7 June 1954, 16 days before his 42nd birthday, from cyanide poisoning. An inquest determined his death as a suicide, but it has been noted that the known evidence is also consistent with accidental poisoning.

    Following a public campaign in 2009, the British Prime Minister Gordon Brown made an official public apology on behalf of the British government for "the appalling way [Turing] was treated". Queen Elizabeth II granted a posthumous pardon in 2013. The term "Alan Turing law" is now used informally to refer to a 2017 law in the United Kingdom that retroactively pardoned men cautioned or convicted under historical legislation that outlawed homosexual acts.[15]



    So, our prejudices used to try to force people into a straitjacket of "normality" . . . and it was cruel. Imprisonment and chemical castration for a leaning you were born with is not something I would ever wish to see return. Live and let live.

    I have prejudices and I have to wrestle with them. I dislike watching films with overtly gay relationships, for example, but I also know a number of gay people, enjoy their company and respect them as fellow humans. It has been a long struggle for non-heterosexual people to become accepted in society. That they no longer have to hide in the shadows is something to celebrate.
    Prejudices in some cases may be part of how we "are wired". An example of this might be lack of lust in a man -- for a sheep, even if she has been groomed and perfumed. Some people are just prejudiced against sheep, ah tell yeeewwwww!

    People never had to hide in the shadows. They always had a choice. Yes, some were beaten, murdered, etc. But I don't think their first taste of "disapproval" was very drastic.

    Rape is illegal in most cultures. Should it be? Maybe -- just maybe -- , people could/should learn to refrain, at times, from doing whatever-the-heck-they-want-to-do. This is not rocket science, and doesn't have to be very complicated. As far as I know, it's not illegal to want to do something. But actions have consequences, as Isaac Newton might have predicted. Merely quietly thinking about being a pervert won't get anybody persecuted, prosecuted, arrested, assaulted, criticized, or even teased. Nature deals with mutations and/or lack of mutations in a relatively basic way: pragmatism. When a herd of animals gets so large that the food supply is insufficient, the animals' reproduction rate diminishes. Maybe this is what is happening in the world today (or at least parts of it). I have long believed that we are "wired" a certain way, by a system of instinctual features. One of my favorite examples is that of an infant (human baby) having fear of wiggly things (such as a dangling gummy worm candy). In similar fashion, we are "wired" to be heterosexual. We are not "wired" to be perverts, but in some cases, people are taught to be. And some are taught to be criminals. Society deals with these things, sometimes in relatively "pragmatic" ways, regardless of whether it seems "natural" or "fair" to everyone. I generally believe that "fairness" is largely a myth.

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    • #92
      Originally posted by Old Pilot View Post

      Accepting undesirable change meekly is for sheeple. Be one, if that's all you're capable of. But please don't expect everything to be fun and easy -- just because you accept the situation as reality. I see reality and don't like everything I see. So I try to change certain things.
      Hey OP,
      Pearls.
      That joker in poker has a sister named fate and she deals the cards.
      Cheers

      Comment


      • #93
        Originally posted by trueyeti View Post

        Hey Walker,
        I can understand what you convey when you say, "This isn't a natural change. It's being forced." That said.....
        .

        IMO the phenomena that you are describing are "observable variables" that represent "change." IMO, "change" is normal within natural systems. When variables are observed to "change" within a natural system, it can be described to be in a state of "flux."

        Humans are natural and we reside within the boundaries of the planet, which is a natural system. The observation of those phenomena that you point out are valid. IMO, they represent change. IMO "change" is "normal" within a natural system that is in flux. If a flame is set to a pot of water, the water will be observed to boil. The state of the water changes. (Natural system).

        If you will, "change" within a natural system, exhibits observable characteristics that "change" the dynamics within the natural system. The things that you are pointing out appear mate. Rather than drawing an ideological conclusion from what is observed, I merely point out that the observed phenomena you describe are "normal" to a natural system that is in flux.

        Should someone from 100 years prior to the invention of the light bulb have seen a working light bulb within their time, they would have thought it "un-natural." Forward to the present day, observable changes that are afoot in modern times are normal, when considering how things normally change within natural systems in general. That said, "change," is a certainty within natural systems IMO. Whether or not I "support whatever," is irrelevant. You might as well ask me if I support the chance of rain on Tuesday. We both know that the dewpoint, atmospheric pressure, and the lapse rate have everything to do with it raining on Tuesday, or not. Neither you or I, can change those things....they are variables of a natural system and are observable. Heck we could try a rain dance....that could work, or not.

        With respect to the "black or white" judgement that you seem to be interested in eliciting from me, when you wrote, "Is that what you are supporting," you could simply try to understand....that I stand firmly in the middle ground mate. I simply make an observation on natural systems and compare it with today's events and point out that the human condition, is a natural system. I do not seek to make an ideological judgement based on the comparison, like you seem to be ready, willing and able to. There is someone in history who kind of refused to judge others....and I think you know who that is. Be kind, rewind, and Cheers. Again, the times they are a changing.

        PS. IMO, times are challenging. IMO, It is up to us as individuals to adapt to the changes in the "best" and "most appropriate" ways that we can. Cheers again.
        Judgment is very important. If we had no judicial system, we'd be in more trouble than we already are in.
        Show me someone who doesn't judge, and I'll show you someone who isn't alive.
        Last edited by Old Pilot; 06-20-2022, 12:55 AM.

        Comment


        • #94
          Originally posted by sally View Post
          "Imprisonment and chemical castration for a leaning you were born with is not something I would ever wish to see return." Live and let live.

          This was not the idea behind my link. Homosexuality has indeed been part of the human pyschological biome probably since the beginning of humankind. My argument is with the early identification and chemical involvement of so called trans CHILDREN. Who is identifying these children? A brainwashed 'woke' parent who maybe wished for a boy/girl cat/dog creature? How can a child, not having even entered puberty have even the slightest idea what that actually means in real life? Puberty is confusing enough without having to make such choices espescially with not having full experiential knowledge of what actual consent is. Also, the trend of trans people has been to pretty much take over the plight of the homosexual and put everybody in the same boat. Gay Pride now takes a real backseat. Again trying to solidify the trend with 'laws' we are forced to swallow or be marginalized now for even being 'straight'. Look deeper you will see strong lines of misogyny taking away the most sacred rights of being a real woman and passing it off as widely acceptable socially. "If I can't make Her submit to me wholly I will replace Her with mockery" Examples such as a "trans" man entering a woman's spa and disrobing, showing his penis. Or 'trans' men competing in women's sports events. A man's body is many times physically stronger than a woman's and "calling" yourself a woman and dressing like a woman does not make you one. And just because some creepy old man put his shakey pen to paper is just another forced logos, as if a signature will change billions of years of Natures Ways. It is not about being accepting of all humanity in it's many forms, it is about widespread brainwashing and manipulative social engineering. If anything, these TRENDS will divide humanity even further.
          I agree with you, sally.

          Comment


          • #95
            Look if you guys want to start a political thread to argue about trans kids, that's your right, but you've hijacked what was meant to be a cheerful and positive post.

            Comment


            • #96
              Originally posted by Old blue View Post
              They don’t want to be equal , they want to be special
              They are special. They could even have their own special sports competitions.

              Comment


              • #97
                Originally posted by Cyrus View Post
                You can't use the nonsense of some people to put you off others. I feel like I wished you guys a good black history month only to get a cheerless rant on BLM and Farrakhan. Have you no benevolence and generosity of spirit? I'm a libertarian. I think trans indoctrination of kids is creepy and destructive. Has nothing to do with wishing you a happy pride month, any more than predator priests should stop someone from wishing happy easter.
                It may have been your specification of this month's association that pushed buttons. If you try to "explain" yourself, it may not succeed. Cheers . . .

                Comment


                • #98
                  Originally posted by whiskynovember View Post

                  Hi Rose, I'd love to weigh in in your support, but that would end the thread, as it always does when I take the gloves off. But I think I can keep from triggering the snowflakes with this: Since I'm childless by choice, thanks to having choice, I have no idea how gut-wrenching the moral dilemma facing parents is in this matter. Worse, whenever the state gets involved it complicates things by orders of magnitude.

                  It's disgusting when others engineer the victimization of their institution simply to edify disagreement with something that takes place extraneous to that institution. When gay marriage came into being it did so as an entity independent of and posing no threat to anything outside of it, but the witch hunt hysteria found fertile ground for an attack on America's institution of marriage. Then it became a cultural contest to climb upon the cross, point fingers, and claim to have been forced to do so. That has happened here.
                  Nope. It was never about gay marriage. Gay people have been getting married for thousands of years. It's same-sex marriage that is the big deal. Re-defining marriage has transformed society in a very big way, and not automatically necessarily for the better.

                  Comment


                  • #99
                    Originally posted by ravenhome777 View Post
                    1. What does this have to do with the Forrest Fenn treasure hunt?
                    2. I thought we weren't allowed to discuss politics on this forum. My thread got locked the last time I even stuck my pinky toe into these waters. How about we lock this thread? Not appropriate.
                    3. I have no problem with people's sexual preferences, but I do have a problem with people making a bigger deal out of it than it is. As Forrest said, "Leave people alone."
                    I'm with you on this. The treasure hunt has faded and can't compete with the onslaught of perversion agendas.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by trueyeti View Post

                      Hey OP,
                      Pearls.
                      That joker in poker has a sister named fate and she deals the cards.
                      Cheers
                      Fate plays a smaller role than people believe.
                      And one's luck is largely/mostly determined by one's own actions (which include their decisions).

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Cyrus View Post
                        Look if you guys want to start a political thread to argue about trans kids, that's your right, but you've hijacked what was meant to be a cheerful and positive post.
                        I hope you can (ethically) find ways to be happy during all of this month -- regardless of what you want to label/call it.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Old Pilot View Post

                          I'm with you on this. The treasure hunt has faded and can't compete with the onslaught of perversion agendas.
                          Equal rights for all humans does not = "perversion agendas".

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Old Pilot View Post

                            Fate plays a smaller role than people believe.
                            And one's luck is largely/mostly determined by one's own actions (which include their decisions).
                            How large is the role people believe fate to play?

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Old Pilot View Post

                              Nope. It was never about gay marriage. Gay people have been getting married for thousands of years. It's same-sex marriage that is the big deal. Re-defining marriage has transformed society in a very big way, and not automatically necessarily for the better.
                              Gay people have been forcefully enslaved to mates they neither desire nor would willfully choose were their rights as strong as everyone else's (so as not to get murdered and be allowed to do business in town). "Re-defining marriage" as a bond between two people who love each other sounds like you hate your spouse. Don't like gay marriage? Don't get gay married. Mind your own bedroom otherwise.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Cyrus View Post
                                Look if you guys want to start a political thread to argue about trans kids, that's your right, but you've hijacked what was meant to be a cheerful and positive post.
                                Sorry, Cyrus. You should've posted well wishes in the Alice in Wonderland forum. Everything is considered there.

                                Comment

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